Hi Colyn,

My kop draai nou so, voel of ek te veel gedrink het!

Met al die voorstelle en idees het jy nou 'n goeie voorsmaak waaroor Koi nou eintlik gaan.
Die punt bly staan, ongeag watter soort "Media" jy gebruik, skoon maak sal jy dit moet skoon maak.............ten minste eenkeer per jaar.
As jy dit dus meer keer gedurende die jaar moet doen, kom dit neer hoe moeilik dit gaan wees om dit uit te haal en skoon te maak.

Wees van die begin af slim en spaar jouself baie moeite!
Onthou net soms is dit bloot logika.

Sterkte.

Hell, die manne pos nou so vinnig!

Met verwysing na die 25mm pyp, met 'n stelsel soos joune is 'n 25mm pyp heeltemal onvoldoende!
Dit gaan net water vloei probleme ver oorsaak

Chris to turn my water ... 185,000 liters without the sumps and streams, every two hours is economically just not viable. To pump roughly 100,000 liters per hours will require a lot of pumping assets and power. We are faced with the dark issue from Eskom where "abusing" will be severely punished and a sudden sharp rise in power consumption will definitely get them going.

This was the main reason why I basically built a 45,000 liter pond that will be converted into a big wetland. I will also limit the fish to only 30 per pond.

Pond #1 = 56,000 liters and Pond #2 is 65,000 liters and each will have 30 fish in.

If rotation of the water every 2 hours is cast in stone then I have a problem and these ponds will go to wildlife.

Jis maar nou het die Server darem spectacularly gecrash

Chris ... ek beplan alles wat ek doen so dat dit instandhouding moet vergemaklik.

Pieter ... ja jong ek weet 25mm is baie dun maar ek probeer a manier uitwerk dat ek met gravity kan regkom sonder om te veel water deur die bottom te trek en dan die oorvloei na Dam #2 te belemmer nie.

Ok Pond #1 is getting Coprox today ... so by the weekend I should have all three ponds online ... I am really looking forward to it.

Thanks to everyone that posted in this thread.

Jis..die thread is aktief en ek kry nie eers een email om vir my tese nie...

Colyn wrote:

Pieter ... ja jong ek weet 25mm is baie dun maar ek probeer a manier uitwerk dat ek met gravity kan regkom sonder om te veel water deur die bottom te trek

As jy "Gravity feed" wou gebruik het moes jy tenminste 110mm pyp gebruik. Meeste ouense gbruik "gravity feed" bottom drains en suig dan uit 'n "sump" area uit. Die goue reel met "Gravity feed" is dat grooterpype beter is...miskien moes jy 300mm gebruik het om die groter volume vinnerger telaat beweeg. Onthou dan omdat jou dam se volume groter is gaan dit meer afval produkte maak en omdat die water in jou stelsel stadiger gaan sirkuleer gaan pype ook vinniger opblok want die afval produkte gaan gaan le op die bodem van die pype...met tyd natuurlik. Hoop jy kan die nog regstel. Dunner pype word gebruik wanneer mense van die lyn af suig of as 'n mense met "pressure" water daar deur druk maar met "gravity" is dit goot pype al die pad...

Net gou ietsie oor die filters ook....
Soos ek in my vorige posts gese het. Wanneer 'n mens filter materiaal wil koop moet jy altyd die volgende twee dinge in gedagte hou..
1. The surface area.
2. How easy to clean.

Ek ken mense wat elke jaar al die filter materiaal uitpak en moet skoonmaak...vat hulle amper die hele dag en is 'n gemors, ek is van plan om die "hobby" tedoen totdat ek 80 is en ek is nie vanplan om met sulke dinge nou of self dan mee tesukkel nie.

Dankie Wayne ... daai artikel van jou is regtig baie goed.

Colyn wrote:

Pieter ... ja jong ek weet 25mm is baie dun maar ek probeer a manier uitwerk dat ek met gravity kan regkom sonder om te veel water deur die bottom te trek en dan die oorvloei na Dam #2 te belemmer nie.

Met 'n 25 mm pyp gaan jy nie eers 4000 liters trek nie en moet nie die waarde van die "bottom drain" onderskat nie. Al die gemors gaan ondertoe, en as jy nie genoeg suigkrag onder het nie, gaan jy probleme ontwikkel. Trek eerder meer vanaf jou "bottom drain" ten koste van 'n laer vloei na jou volgende dam.

Die 25 mm pyp sal ook moontlik later verstop.

Ten opsigte van die biomedia sakke waarvan ek gepraat het, hier is 'n foto van die sakke wat by Makro beskikbaar is. (kos afdeling) Dit is baie elasties en hoe meer media jy ingooi, hoe groter word die gate, en met so rol van 30 meter kom jy baie ver @ R 30.00.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Dankie Paul.

So Friday was the big day and Pond #1 get's its water. By late afternoon it is 3/4 full and we have to stop because all the domestic tanks are dry and my wife was not happy

Big was my dissapointment when I noticed on Saturday morning that the water level has dropped around 20mm.

So this morning we started excavating the bottom drain. Fortunately it is on the downhill side of the pool and close to the edge. Soil looks damp under the pipe, so tomorrow we will excavate more. I cannot believe this happened. We took great care with the joints but maybe a seal slipped.

Just thought I will give you some progress report.

So het jy vir grooter 110ml pype gegaan op die bottom drains?

Ek het 110mm van die begin af ingehad ... my vraag die ander dag het gegaan oor die volume wat ek will laat deurkom. As 110 in a tenk invoer en ek laat net 25 of 50 uit ... so my vraag was of dit voldoende vloei volume is.

hmm..ok dan het ek heeltemal jou vraag verkeer verstaan.

Well seems like the problem is now solved and I have started filling Pond #1 for the second time.

I need some advice and discussion of the following structures ...



A = Pond #3 - 45,000 liters

The primary purpose of this pond will be to act as a vegetation filter and have some goldfish and maybe some kurpers in. The fish is obviously for the insects and whatever food happens to be there but will also be the decoy to attract the predators and hopefully keep them away from the Koi.

B = Weir structure

This was done so that the bottomdrain is protected from the obvious potential of catching rotting leaves that will land in the pond from mostly the inhabitants of the pond. It was also done so that water can flow freely without floating plants choking the spillway.

C = Surface skimmer

This is where surface skimming for pond #3 happens and the gate can be closed at will. The box is divided in two C/D with C having 3 layers of concrete stone in Avocado bags. Water filters through the stone and then out into D. I am confident that all plant material will be trapped here that is drawn off by the skimmer.

D = Settlement chamber

Not much to say about this one.

E = Course filtration

All water drawn off the whole system will land here on it;s way back to the pump pit. This box also contains 3 layers of bagged concrete stone. The spill drop is fairly high so a lot of aeration takes place here.

F = Settlement Chamber

This box is connected to the pump pit in a way that the water level will not fall below the surface of the bagged stone in E.

G = Pump pit

This pit is 2 meters deep and holds around 2,500 liters of water. It was built after I realised that that E and F could not cope with the "transit" volume of water.

From the pump pit water will be pumped through two 1,000 liters tanks that will each contain 300 liters of bio - balls and from the tanks it will flow by gravity over the primary inlet into Pond #1.

I am now thinking of hanging bio brushes in F and D.

I have also found a source for oyster shells and I am planning on bagging them an place them in the bottom of F and D.

My question is this ...

How will you employ the above setup if it was your system ... what other filtration material will you use and wat plants will you add and where.

Thanks.



Plants in here are ...

Palmiet, Papyrus and Vark ore.

Hi Colyn,

I trust you are well today.

I am concerned about your flow through your filter.

Do you perhaps have a cross section of the filter system?

How does the water get from each chamber - I presume the water flows from the top of chambers B & D to the top of chamber E.
In chamber E you have stone in bags (highly restrictive - especially
after a season or two when the organics build up).

Water flows from chamber E to chamber F - how? at the bottom? Through the small pipes I see on the picture? Alarm bells are ringing ....

Back to chamber E- how is the stone packed in there? Directly on the floor? On a grid above the outlet pipes on the bottom?

Chambers F - G: I see the water comes out at the bottom of chamber F and moves to Chamber G through an opening at the bottom - straight across. If left like this a bit of a waste of space and time and this is not very efficient. If you placed a row or two of brushes - from top to bottom so there is a complete barrier or wall - then chamber G would be more useful.

My long term concerns are: 1) Where the organics are going to end up? 2) Will pockets of anaerobic areas build up rapidly (yes) 3) how are you going to remove the organic build up? 4) Chamber E will build up with organics over time and the water flow will become so restricted that there is a very real chance of the next chambers sucking dry.

Organic build up in ponds or filter systems = anaerobic areas developing = hydrogen sulphide = toxic to fish in VERY small quantities. A silent killer or at the very least stressor of our koi and vastly under-estimated.

Regards,
Chris

Chris Neaves wrote:

Hi Colyn,

I trust you are well today.

I am concerned about your flow through your filter.

Do you perhaps have a cross section of the filter system?

I am feeling better today because it seems that the leak in Pond #1 has been resolved and the pond is 50% full. Should overflow by tonight and then I can fire up the whole system.

I will do a cross section diagram tomorrow with actual dimensions.

Quote :

How does the water get from each chamber - I presume the water flows from the top of chambers B & D to the top of chamber E.
In chamber E you have stone in bags (highly restrictive - especially
after a season or two when the organics build up).

You are correct with the flow assumed here.

I do appreciate the potential maintenance in E. What else could be done ?

Quote :

Water flows from chamber E to chamber F - how? at the bottom? Through the small pipes I see on the picture? Alarm bells are ringing ....

Why the alarm bells ?

Quote :

Back to chamber E- how is the stone packed in there? Directly on the floor? On a grid above the outlet pipes on the bottom?

We packed a loose grid of channels with bricks in order to prevent the stone bags from "fusing" to the chamber floor.

Quote :

Chambers F - G: I see the water comes out at the bottom of chamber F and moves to Chamber G through an opening at the bottom - straight across. If left like this a bit of a waste of space and time and this is not very efficient. If you placed a row or two of brushes - from top to bottom so there is a complete barrier or wall - then chamber G would be more useful.

Yes I will place the brushes as suggested by you. Chamber G was an after thought when I realised I made a huge calculation error with the volume capacity of E and F.

Quote :

My long term concerns are:
1) Where the organics are going to end up?
2) Will pockets of anaerobic areas build up rapidly (yes)
3) how are you going to remove the organic build up?
4) Chamber E will build up with organics over time and the water flow will become so restricted that there is a very real chance of the next chambers sucking dry.

At this moment in time the obvious reality for me is that chambers C,D,E,F will be places that will require periodic maintenance.

Is there any way to avaid any and all maintenance in a system ?

Quote :

Organic build up in ponds or filter systems = anaerobic areas developing = hydrogen sulphide = toxic to fish in VERY small quantities. A silent killer or at the very least stressor of our koi and vastly under-estimated.

I am aware of the potential problem of hydrogen sulphide ... how do you avaoid that ?

Thank you very much for your response ... I appreciate it.

Hi Colyn.

Ek weet nie of ek enige advies kan gee nie, jou setup is so groot en ek persoonlik het nog noot met so groot dam gewerk nie, en soos jy in van jou eerste boodskappe gese het, normale koi pond beginsels kan nie hier toe gepas word nie...dit moet 'n bietjie gebuig / gebreek word....maar ek sien baie maintenace met die hele setup...maar ek skat jou werkers sal dit vir jou op 'n maandlikse stelsel doen wat nie vir jou rerig so groot probleem dan sal wees nie.

As ek kan waag om raad tegee sal ek se dat jy nie die sakke met klippe moet begruik nie - gebruik slegs die borsels. Een van my vriende het 'n 60 000L dam waar hulle net borsels gebruik vir maganiese filtrasie en bio logiese filtrasie - die dam is altyd silwer skoon...so ek skat dit werk. Daar is 280 Borsels in die setup - Robert and Carol Wagners koi pond

As die stelsel nou alles werk soos dit moet, hoe gereeld word die water gesirkuleer?

So waar staan jy met jou budget op die oomblik?

Wayne

Op hierdie stadium pomp ek ongeveer 30,000 liter per uur en ek het voorsiening gemaak om nog 15,000 liter per uur te kan byvoeg.

Budget gewys gaan ek nou na 43,000.00 toe. Die Coprox was effens onverwags met die prys maar ek is nie gestress nie. Die stygings in sement prys het my ook gevang met betrekking tot my oorspronlike mikpunt maar nou ja ek het in die konstruksie bedryf gesien as a projek inkom teen minder as 30% meer as die budget dan is dit nog min of meer in lyn

Dan is daar nog die kwessie van oorskot materiaal wat bereken kan word. Die addisionele ongeveer 3,000 liter wat ek by die filters by moes bou vir die "transito" water het ook 'n effek op die begroting.

As alles volgens plan loop gaan die hele stelsel seker so binne die volgende 4 ure aan die loop wees en ek sien uit daarna.

Dankie vir jou bydrae.

Wayne ... die klippe is moontlik iets wat gaan verander. My damme het erg groen geword met die stop en staan en gaan en stop van die stelsel so ek het baie alge. Ek begin nou maar eers die plante insit en die kwekerye hier sal eers laat in Augustus serious waterplante kry. Die hiasinte begin nou wortels maak en nuwe groei toon. Die nommer #2 en #3 dam is sedert Donderdag aan die loop met a tydelik shortcut en daar is reeds a sigbare verbetering.

Ek kry volgende week die bio-balls en dan sal die twee groot tenks inkom. Ek kry ook a aantal groot borsels saam met dit en sal dan bietjie aanpassings maak.

Die startup stock kurpers vir die vegetation pond kom ook volgende week.

So dinge behoort interressant te raak binne die volgende 10 dae

Ok I am now the proud owner of three ponds full of water ... and algae and heaven knows what else.

I am now busy filling the sump up before I start the system so that we can get some calibration marks on the levels in the pump pit. I have around 5,000 liters in the final filtration chambers and sump of which around 4,000 liters are available to use in the "transit" system.

Thank you to all that responded here.

Well at 11h00 today we fired the system up ... the pump well was filled to the brim

With abated breath I watched the water in the sump drop and just when I thought it was another miss the water strted returning and picked up speed.

So this evening I sat on the steps and drank coffee as the sun went down and I am a happy man

Give us a pic of what you see when you are drinking your coffee.

There you go ... tomorrow I will get some better shots ... this evening I just sat and savored the satisfaction of seeing the whole system in action.

Can someone tell me about the foam I have on the water please.

I will not worry too much about it at this stage. Probably a bit of dissolved organics created in the ponds that were filled a while ago, and I have noticed that Coprox also creates a bit a foam initially.

It will probably go away after a few partial water changes which you have to do anyway becasue it is a new system.