Verskeie mense vervaardig bonding liquid maar ek het die produk gebruik wat Alcolin PermoBond vervaardig. Is so taai wit melk kleur. Verf dit sommer bo oor die pyp asook gedeelte waar sement aangewend moet word en dit neem so 30min om droog te word. Toe ek die krake in my dam herstel het, het ek gedeelte van die kraak uitgekap en toe met teel sement en bonding liquid herstel en die volgende dag daaroor geverf met die waterblok.

As dit koud is in Kempton mag dit langer neem om droog te word en goeie voorbeeld daarvan is toe ek so maand gelede my nuwe partitions in filters ingesit het, moes ek omtrent 3 dae wag voordat sement droog was.

So, ek neem aan die bonding compound moet heeltemal droog wees voordat ek die teelsement/bonding compound mengsel opsit.

So, ek maak nie my dam vol hierdie naweek nie...

Albie,

To seal between "plactic" and "concrete" use Prostruct 617ns form
StonCor

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Dit sal dalk goed wees as jy beide kante van die muur seel

Hier is fotos van die herstel toe jets gelek het:

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Progressing slowly, but always a hick-up..

Pieter, I didn't use the Stoncor product, as it was Saturday and they did not answer their phone.

I used Marius's (hoe spel mens dit?) advice, painted with bonding compound and covered the 2 inlets and one outlet with tile cement mixed with bonding compound. When dry, I covered it with Coprox (two layers).

Being paranoid, I covered those areas since yesterday with Aquablok Premium (the one that has supposedly the "membrane"added- two layers yesterday a few hours apart and one this morning in between the rain. Looks good and looks as if it will be waterproof. Wanted to fill tomorrow!

Just a quick background, when building, I used the Coprox cement additive with all the cement that i mixed. It was also included in the plaster mix. I also used salt as the recommendation by Pieter.

Then I painted 2 layers of Coprox- the wall was dry for at least a week before I painted.

Then as a "family activity- me not being popular" we painted a third layer of Coprox a week layer. (that was a week ago).

But getting into the pond today, amidst intermittent showers, I saw the following

Areas on the bottom (not really worried-bottom is pretty solid concrete and relatively thick plaster)

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And a few spots like this among the sides, where the cement also is visible:

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The big question then- everything is set up to add water, but if necessary, I can wait a week:

1.Should I add water tomorrow and see what happens, or

2.Paint with something else like waterblok, the superior version, tomorrow

3.Or add water this week, see if it leaks and the paint with Aquablok or something else next week?

4. Or else, the black Waterblok stands out around the pipes, contrasting the grey (I know it wont be for long, but what about one coat for the whole pond, even diluted, just to make sure that there is no leaks??

Please give me your honest opinions- been going for nearly 2 months and don't mind to wait another week if it is necessary)

Should we vote???

(Remember, still looking for a big koi to give some presence in my pond) (Let me know it there is a private sale- coming to CT beginning of Sept)

Hallo Albie

Spelling is correct.

I don't think the pond will leak at all since you did a good job when you built your pond. The mortar might leak into pond at the spots where paint peeled - that is what happened to me when my engineer placed cement building bricks in my filter system to ''keep the shading net in place". pH went up a bit till I removed the blocks.

Maybe you can clean the peeled areas and paint with Coprox again since that was the product you used from the start. My vote will go for Waterblok but since it is a dark black colour you will need to repaint everything to get the same colour - bit of a waist after all the effort so far.

To me the primary reason for painting a pond is to isolate the concrete from your pond/ fish. Secondly it will make your pond watertight and keep the moisture inside the concrete.

You can consider buying a Chagoi. They grow fast and very friendly Koi. I am sure Paul will be able to help you.

After the rain, it looks like this-22h00 (sorry, these are all flash photos:

Should I carry on and fill the pond or paint with Waterblok and if so, how many layers?

Side:

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Bottom:

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Inlets:

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Well, I think it is pretty clear- do not use Coprox!!

Regards

Albie

I see your shots on the Coprox peeling and I am thinking ... Coprox is water based ... why did you dry the walls out so much before you painted the Coprox.

My opinion is that the walls was too dry when you painted. You did not achieve a BOND with the cement. Did you use the bonding liquid prior to painting. In my ponds that was an expense I did not budget for but bit the bullet and applied it before I applied the Coprox. I have no peeling.

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The very best waterproofing for plaster is Waterblok. It works great also on concrete, brick and other stone products. This is a penetrating and not a surface sealer. Plaster statues will last for several years outside. Comes with a five year guarantee. It will also prevent frost damage in concrete.

Brushable general purpose medium bodied waterproofing compound. Apply to wet or dry surfaces. Seals parapets, flashings, gutters etc. Use with reinforcing membrane as required. Adheres to wood, metal, concrete and plaster

Rubberised Waterproofing Compound (R.W.P.C.).is a mineral filled emulsion of a refined grade of bitumen which contains a high percentage of rubber latex. It is a multi-purpose waterproofing and sealing compound. It is a water based emulsion and requires no heating. The product has the consistency of a soft paste and is thixotropic. It is very easy to apply with brushes or soft brooms.

The first layer you mix with 50% water. Is brownish when wet but turns dark black when dry. Apply the second layer undiluted.

As stupid as it might sound I first used chip board as partitions in my filter system ( my time ran out to do it the proper way and Perspex was far to expensive for me), so I painted the chip board with waterblok. We all know that chip board is a horrible product to use when water is present but believe me it was still ‘brand new’ 3 months later. I took it out and replaced it with a metal sheet, painted with waterblok.

I will bet you my mad Doitsu Koi that it will last for years to come

I have painted my pond 2 or 3 days after the plaster.

Waterblok is good but nothing wrong with Coprox. Problem for Albie is that he did not achieve a bond between his paint and plaster. WHatever he whants to do now will have to follow after he cleaned the mess out first. He should first scrub the pond down with wire brush to get rid of all and any loose paint. The sand the walls with sandpaper to thin out the edges where the Coprox actually bnded, if any

Then he can decide to go again ... with either Coprox or Waterblok as you suggest. This time he should wet down the plaster before painting the Coprox. I diluted my first coat and painted on damp walls. You could see the Coprox soaking into the plaster. The second pure coat was applied as soon as the first coat was touch dry.

He plastered so well that the painting is mostly for looks and to protect his pH.

Hi Albie,

Jy kan nie waterblock op die oppervlakte aanwend as dit so dop nie, dit sal nie werk nie. Waterblock werk net op 'n "rou" oppervlakkte, soos bo vermeld.

Hoekom het die Coprox gedop?
1. Die oppervlakte was te droog (Coprox se instruksies is duidelik dat die oppervlakte klam moet wees voor aanwending)
2. Die Coprox mengsel was te "droog" ( te min water in die mengsel)
3. Die Coprox was nie eweredig nie ( dit moet die heeltyd geroer word tydens aanwending.
4. Vetterig oppervlakte

Enige van bogenoemde redes kan veroorsaak dat daar blase gevorm word wat dan later begin skilfer.

Ek stem saam met Colyn dat die oppervlakte heeltemal skoon gemaak moet word en dat die laag "oortollige coprox" verwyder moet word.
Onthou net dat daar reeds ook Coprox in die sement oppervlakte ingetrek het, wat reeds gedeeltelik sy werk doen.

Jou probleem is egter watse soort "sealer" jy nou oor die oppervlakte gaan gebruik.

Ek het die volgende gedoen, nadat my 10 000lt ( wat met coprox behandel was) na 16 maande begin dop het.
1. Ek het die water uitgelaat en die dam goed laat droog word.
2. Die oppervlakte was afgeskuur en met sout suur afgewas.
3. Daarna was twee lae "paint sealer" aangewend.
4. Daarna was 6 lae Flash Harry (wat membrane binne bevat) aangewend nadat elke laag goed droog was.

Dit was vyf jaar terug, en daar is nog geen probleme sederdien nie.

Well, I'll try to answer some of the queries and then need serious advice!

Pieter:

Quote :

nadat jy gepleister het moet die pleister heeltemal droog wees voordat jy die "verf". "n Week behoort voldoende te wees.
As jy die Coprox met die water meng, moet jy dit oor die water stroei en dit in roer om te meng, terwyl dit aangeverf word moet dit die heel tyd geroer word.

I waited a week after plastering and painted with Coprox (2 layers) on 18 July.

Then I fixed the leaking pipe 24 July.

Colyn:

Quote :

I see your shots on the Coprox peeling and I am thinking ... Coprox is water based ... why did you dry the walls out so much before you painted the Coprox.

Well, I dried the walls out, as the salt came to the surface BUT, before painting, we made sure that we thoroughly sprayed the walls with water. This was also done before the second coat. Perhaps the area in the sun dried out too quickly- you'll see in the pictures.

Colyn:

Quote :

My opinion is that the walls was too dry when you painted. You did not achieve a BOND with the cement. Did you use the bonding liquid prior to painting

No, I did not use a bonding liquid, I did not know I had to.

If I should cover those areas again with Coprox, how should I wet/using bonding liquid (First wet, then bonding liquid, then Coprox?? Totally unsure.. Or perhaps mix bonding liquid with Coprox? This is what some guys do, I believe

Marius:

Quote :

MariusThe very best waterproofing for plaster is Waterblok.

I see it has a butamen base, or is it water soluble- I had a lot of trouble with butamen in the past. I would prefer a water base product.

I have used Aquablok Premium for the cover over the pipes and it looks good. The guy at the shop claims that it has "membrane" in it. My impression after painting over the pipe inlets was that it looked strong and waterproof.

Colyn:

Quote :

Whatever he whants to do now will have to follow after he cleaned the mess out first. He should first scrub the pond down with wire brush to get rid of all and any loose paint. The sand the walls with sandpaper to thin out the edges where the Coprox actually bnded, if any

It is basically only one wall that was affected, as well as the bottom. That wall gets more sun, so perhaps it dried out too quickly

A few pictures:

West wall, basically no spot

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North:

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South

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East wall:

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Pieter:

Quote :

Hoekom het die Coprox gedop?
1. Die oppervlakte was te droog (Coprox se instruksies is duidelik dat die oppervlakte klam moet wees voor aanwending)
2. Die Coprox mengsel was te "droog" ( te min water in die mengsel)
3. Die Coprox was nie eweredig nie ( dit moet die heeltyd geroer word tydens aanwending.
4. Vetterig oppervlakte

1. Miskien, maar ek het redelik goed natgespuit
2. Volgens instruksies
3. Heeltyd geroer
4. Weet nie, maar behoort nie te wees nie

Miskien het die area wat middag son kry te vinnig uitgedroog en die probleme veroorsaak.

So, what now?

1. The east wall is mostly affected- should I brush it off and paint with Coprox (still got some left, perhaps more diluted, or add bonding liquid) and add water to the pond after a second layer

OR

2.Strip everything (the whole pond- but 3/4 is ok) (looks as if it is sticking well most of the places except for the east wall and bottom) and paint with something else

Or

3.Strip the areas that peels and cover the whole pond with something like Waterblok, Aquablok Superior or Flash Harry?

The most important question is:

If it was your pond, what would you have done?

If possible, I would like to start doing something this afternoon and tonight, as I'm leaving on Monday and only returng on on Friday

Thanks

Albie

It contains Bitumen but is water based:

Waterblok Multi-Purpose Rubberized Bitumen Waterproofing Compound

A revolutionary and extremely versatile waterproofing product capable of waterproofing surfaces ranging from earth dams (with no concrete or other reinforcement, just a geotextile) for water impounding to concrete roof decks, toilets & bathrooms, canopies, ledges, plant boxes, any other concrete or masonry surface, galvanized metal sheeting and even wooden surfaces.It is water base, odorless, non-toxic and suitable for the storage of potable water

Waterblok Acrylic

A water base brushable 100% acrylic coating material creating a high quality, long lasting waterproofing system which is highly elastic, impervious to water and protects against the effect of ultra-violet rays. Ideal for use on exterior walls and any sloping area

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Well, the following photos, taken just an hour ago, shows that I need to strip everything- I got in the pond this afternoon, I've been adding some water since this morning to see how it goes.

I started to brush with slightly diluted pool acid (1 cup water to 4 cups acid-just a random guess)

The result after 10 minutes!!:

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So, I will get my gardener to strip all the Coprox and I will go for your Waterblok and paint next weekend.

I believe you used the Waterblok Multi-Purpose Rubberized Bitumen Waterproofing Compound in stead of the Waterblok Acrylic?

You also said that you mix the first layer with 50% water. "Is brownish when wet but turns dark black when dry. Apply the second layer undiluted" (after how long can one paint the second layer?).

Did you only use two layers and when can one add water? I suppose I will paint on Saturday

Thanks
Albie

After spending all your Rands on paint's you could have just as well marblelite the pond and know it will be water tight and never have to be painted again. But no marblelite is to expensive

Yes Albie, I used the rubber waterblok. They say when it is black it is dry but they also say you must wait about 2hours if I remember correctly. In my case I started to paint the next layer directly after the first one since it took me a few hours to complete the first layer. I needed to paint about 45 square meters ( excl the settlement chamber, flower pond, waterfalls and the filter system)

I painted 2 layers only, but did apply more around the jets and bottom drains. You can fill the pond the next day. My 3 year old small pond was painted in June / July and I filled it the next day as well.

Use turpentine to clean your hands. Nothing else will help and I had many small black dots all over my body days after the paint job.

Thanks Marius, will go ahead next weekend.

Collin, to my defense, I followed the advice on the forum... Even "hydroseal" would have been a better option. I made sure that the walls were damp/wet when we painted, etc.

Perhaps the salt in the cement caused the Coprox to lift..

Quote :

After spending all your Rands on paint's you could have just as well marblelite the pond and know it will be water tight and never have to be painted again. But no marblelite is to expensive

No one ever suggested marblelite, and I really tried to make sure that this pond doesn't leak.

So, this time I tried to look past expense and did what I thought was the best, seeing the advice came from the the best guys in the business

Regards
Albie

Hi Albie,

Waterblock will not work on that anymore!

If you want to Marble-lite, phone Eugene on 082 962 0313 for a quote.

Ek sou die kans gewaag het, water ingesit het en gekyk het of die dam lek; ek is amper seker dat dit nie sal lek nie!

PS: Onthou jy die;

Quote :

Once completely dry, I will use Hydro Seal.Pieter de V swears by it- it has a cement base that penetrates the plaster.

Nou is ek totaal deurmekaar.

Ek het gereel dat my tuinier more alles strip met HCl en wou dan Saterdag verf.

Pieter, by burst nou my bubble. Ek wou aanvanklik Hydroseal gebruik het, maar omdat niemand, behalwe jy dit aanbeveel het nie, het ek maar eers verbygehou en almal het van Coprox gepraat- jy sal sien in die ou posts dat dit my eerste keuse was. En omdat Hydroseal die mixing compund by het, behoort hy lekker te bond.

So:

1. Moet my tuinier more met swemdbadsuur die hele dam strip?

2. Of wag vir die naweek en volmaak? (Ek is in Noordwes die week) (Visses nou al amper 2 maande uit dam)

3. Na al die Coprox en en sout in die sement, wat van Hydroseal?- ek is nogal lus daarvoor

4. Sal Waterblok afdop, al verdun ek die 1e laag?

5. Die ou by die verfwinkel glo aan Aquablok

Enige ander idees dringend asb, ek raak nou op en wil die visse terugkry in die dam. Onthou ook net, ek is geen bouer nie- my eerste selfdoen bou projek.

Het nog nooit probleme met Coprox gehad nie. Soos Colyn se, jy het te lank gewag en daarom het die Coprox nie gebind met die pleister nie. Die hoeveelheid sout het waarskynlik ook 'n rol gespeel.

Sien my post aan jou op 9 Julie.

Quote :

You do the plastering the one day and paint with undiluted coprox the next, two coats. You will never have paint pealing off, it looks natural and it should be 100% waterprooof.

Nou sal jy iets ander moet gebruik. Ek persoonlik hou niks van Butimen produkte nie. Na 5 jaar kom dit af.

Ek het al baie sukses gehad met Everbond akriliese verf. Op een van my filter stelsels hou dit na 5 jaar baie goed. Non toxic en nie so duur soos Durapond en ander seelaars nie, en dit kom in swart wat jy aanvanklik wou gehad het. BuildIt takke bemark dit. (Medal Paints) Jy hoef ook nie 14 dae te wag soos met Butimin seelaars nie. Jy kan water insit vier dae later.

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Albie,

skakel vir Eugene, ek dink dit is jou beste opsie!

Almal van ons is nie meesters op die gebied nie (al word daar so gedink) maar die meeste van ons praat uit ondervinding. As jy alles volgens die instruksies op die "Coprox verpakking" gevolg het, moes jy nooit hierdie probleme ondervind het nie.
Ek het 'n goeie idee dat die Coprox wat jy gebruik het " verslaan" was.

Ongeag wat jy besluit om te doen die mure moet afgeskuur word tot op die rou pleister.

Jy kan ook vir Danny (083 274 4082) kontak om te kom kyk of die Hydro Seal nog sal werk.

Ek het vandag met Jacques en Danny gepraat. Hulle voel ek moet die Copox verwyder met swembadsuur 1:water, dan die pleister grofskuur en hulle hydroseal opsit.

So ek twyfel of ek daardie hydroseal moet opsit of die everbond wat Paul aanbeveel het.

Laat my weet asb.

Albie

Hi Albie,

Dit is jou keuse. Een ding is seker afskuur sal jy moet afskuur!

Everbond het my beindruk toe ek sien hoe hulle "waterfeatures" bou met karton bokse wat binne bloot geverf is daarmee en vir maande by ons plaaslike BuildIt geloop het sonder om te lek.

Waar ek dit gebruik het, het dit nog nie probleme gegee na 5 jaar nie, maar kan dalk binnekort begin lek?. Myne het wel gedop op 'n waterval, maar aan die ander kant, die waterval het stadig begin sak aangesien ek nie die fondasie behoorlik gekompakteer het nie. Gevolglik was daar heelwat beweging en min seelaars sal dan hou.

Hydro Seal is dalk baie beter maar ek het geen persoonlike ondervinding daarvan nie.

Paul,

Hydro Seal, was by die SAKTA Skou in Pretoria bekend gestel. Hulle het ook 'n karton-doos in die binne kant met dit geverf, na 'n uur met water vol gemaak en dit het nie gelek nie!

My "overflow" water val, het ook gelek en ek het Hydro Seal binne aangewend, binne 24uur het ek weer 'n waterval gehad..... een wat nie lek nie!

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So Albie, lyk my enige een van die twee gaan werk!