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 Hikui

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albie



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PostSubject: Hikui   Mon Mar 31, 2008 12:52 pm

I posted this on koi quest as well as koivet, and everyone was pretty certain that this sanke has hikui. I attach the link- I have added quite a few photos. They felt I overkilled with the treatment.

http://www.koiquest.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7224

But I want advice on the possible treatment, so please have a look at this.





Quote :
I want to apply your treatment, but medication might be a problem, being in South Africa. I am a doctor, so I will be able to get the stuff somewhere, if I know the ingredients

Quote:
After sedating (How do I do this- I have a 40 liter bucket to put the fish in; I suppose there will be a good link somewhere) the koi, the first thing to do is a good clean up of the area, with any dead or dying scales to being removed and apply rocal (a generic name for this?) or similar to help with the task of cleansing. Once dry start applying the Cauteriser (Will I be able to get this at a pharmacy, or a vet, or any suggestions- what does it contain?) with a cotton bud taking care not to overlap, as this will bleach the area of some of the colour. Once the Cauteriser applied apply the Oraheasive powder (Same question as for the cauteriser) to the painted areas to cover all the Cauteriser. Once you are happy with this apply the Friars Balsam (This is locally available) or G7 sealer out of a pump action plastic spray bottle.


What do you think about the antibiotics- there are 3 shots left- will it be too stressful, or should I give one shot when I catch the fish for your treatment?

Thanks again
Albie

If possible, have a look at the whole post, then things might make more sense!
Thanks
Albie
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Pieter J de Villiers



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:26 pm

Hi,

I have read the posts!

Hi-Kui is not contagious and in real terms it has no effect on the overall health of the Koi, as long as the system in which they are kept is of a suitable standard. The main effect of Hi-Kui is cosmetic. It degrades the appearance of your Koi.
There is no treatment to cure the surface of the skin on the Koi, as there will always be a mark of coloration be left on the spot where the Hi-Kui was.

You may try this:

Clean the area and dry really well. Scrap the infected area with the back of a scalpel or knife.
This will come off just like strawberry jam. It is essential that you remove the entire red grunge. After that clean the area with Hydrogen Peroxide Volume 10, and dry off really good. A hair dryer set on cold will achieve this very well.

You could use a Potassium Permanganate paste, but it could be aggressive if you are going to stand a chance of the red coming back to its former glory. Let the paste dry (use the hair dryer) and cover with friars balsam or

You may freeze the area with lighter gas, and cover it with friars balsam.

Remember there is not medicine for Koi, only poison to kill parasites and infections attacking Koi. So beware of all the medicine you use, it may just kill your Koi.
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albie



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:49 pm

Thanks Pieter

Will try the hydrogen peroxide first and go to the other stuff if needed. Will only be able to do that over the weekend, but the fish looks actually quite good

Keep well

Albie
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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Wed Apr 02, 2008 8:35 pm

Hi Albie, yes, the treatment suggested by Pieter is the normal treatment although some people do not treat, because you are running the risk of an infection by scraping the area. You can also use a Malachite green paste in stead of the PP.

It is normally caused by too much sunlight and maybe you should look at shading your pond a bit to prevent it from happening again. It often occurs in areas where it becomes extremely hot.

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albie



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Fri Apr 04, 2008 7:39 pm

Quote :
Clean the area and dry really well. Scrap the infected area with the back of a scalpel or knife.
This will come off just like strawberry jam. It is essential that you remove the entire red grunge. After that clean the area with Hydrogen Peroxide Volume 10, and dry off really good. A hair dryer set on cold will achieve this very well.

I did it this afternoon. The first two pictures are before scraping:



And this is while doing so:


I then used HP Volume 10 and dried it. Let's see what will happen
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Pieter J de Villiers



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Fri Apr 04, 2008 9:45 pm

Hi Albie,

give it about 10 days.
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albie



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Sun May 11, 2008 6:18 pm

Just thought I will tell you that the wounds are healed now after the HP treatment. It does look as if the colour has faded a bit, but nothing serious. (Photo quality not good!)



The sun and flash actually make it look worse than what it is!

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albie



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Sun May 11, 2008 6:29 pm

Having posted it and with the reflection, it does not give justice to what has happened- it is completely healed. Just show, one must look at your pictures before you throw the fish back!
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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Sun May 11, 2008 8:03 pm

Well done! Cool

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wayneb



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:44 pm

Kan julle asb vir my se of hierdie ook Hikui is?



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Pieter J de Villiers



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Wed Nov 26, 2008 8:07 am

Hi Wayne,

ja, dit wil vir my lyk asof dit Hi-kui is.
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albie



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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Sat Nov 29, 2008 1:47 pm

Looks similar to mine- You can see above what I did- scraped, HP volume 10 and dried. Quite an easy procedure! Still healed (6 months later), although the area is slightly light in colour. Will see what the summer sun this year!

Post pictures afterwards so you can to show us what happened

Albie
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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Fri May 15, 2009 7:27 am

Article by Lourens De Wet from Aquanutro:

On hikui and the importance of fresh food?
Once the “freshness” of koi food falls under suspicion it may no longer offer the nutritional guarantee that is imperative for koi health. Lourens de Wet and Hannes Uys highlight the importance of antioxidants in koi food in preventing the occurrence of disease conditions such as hikui in koi.
Hikui (“red eating disease” or “red cancer”) refers to the thickening of hi or red pigment in koi, primarily occurring in the gosanke varieties. It causes thick, light orange patches on the hi (red colour) patterns, mostly on the koi’s back. These appear as a result of a thickening of the overlying epidermal layer of the fish after weakening or inflammation of the skin caused, for instance by overexposure to sunlight (sunburn) where koi are kept in shallow ponds, in full sunlight or due to handling damage, such as netting abrasions. Furthermore, these thickenings are complicated with infection of opportunistic anaerobic bacteria that attracts minute particles of dirt floating in the water and cause them to decompose. These bacteria proliferate in ponds with low oxygen levels and attach themselves to the weakened parts of the koi’s body. Although there is a lot of controversy on whether it is actually a form of skin cancer or UV light sensitivity, fact is, it is very frustrating to see these spots appear on the best, and often the most expensive of fish, due to the fact that koi with weak hi is less prone to the disease. Besides from being a cosmetic problem, hikui may be detrimental to the health and longevity of koi.
Although a three-week topical hikui treatment may offer some relief once the condition has reached a visible stage, the only real solution lies in the prevention thereof through a combination of a fully functioning supportive immune system of the koi and optimum pond-hygiene and -DO levels. From these, especially the immune-force of the koi plays an imperative role in protecting its body from microorganism intrusion and carcinogenic (cancer forming) oxidation. Just as oxidation can cause rust and deterioration in metals, a similar type of oxidation occurs in koi, resulting in a destruction of essential body protecting components. It is ironic that the cellular activities that keep the koi’s body alive actually generate reactive oxygen molecules (free radicals) as highly destructive byproducts. These free radicals, which are produced following exposure to a number of external hazards (including UV light, pathogen invasion and pond pollutants), can cause extensive damage to the koi’s body cells and are therefore believed to contribute to some of the degenerative diseases of ageing, such as immune system decline and certain cancers. The use of synthetic antioxidants in companion animal foods has, for many years, proved to be an effective and economical method for inhibiting oxidative damage. Etoxyquin, BHA and BHT are among the widely used synthetic antioxidants with documented efficacy and safety. Nonetheless, they have fallen in disfavor with certain owners of companion animals that prefer “all natural” ingredients. This has resulted in growing use of combinations of the natural antioxidants such as sources of vitamins (i.e. ascorbic acid and alpha tocopherols), carotenoids (i.e. ß-carotene) and bioflavonoids. The latter is sourced from a variety of plants of which probably the best-known source in households is Rooibos, a leguminous shrub indigenous to the Ceder mountains of the northwestern Cape in South Africa. Its leaves and stems are used for the manufacture of rooibos tea, a popular health beverage for humans. Bioflavonoids are scavengers of active oxygen species that may adversely affect fish health. In this way bioflavonoids partly take over the function of the antioxidant vitamins and make them more available for other important body functions.
Although the colour of our koi may be an indication of its nutritional and immune status, a more proactive approach towards koi keeping would be combining optimum pond conditions with the supply of a reliable immune supporting koi food. It cannot be stressed enough that it is imperative that a good quality koi food with a guaranteed supplementation of effective antioxidants should be fed daily. Moreover, that the activity of the antioxidant should not be under any suspicion and the koi owner should make sure that the food is still fresh when purchased since it might have just as well been part of a long chain of distribution, especially if it is imported. Feeding fresh food with good nutritional value will not only prevent diseases such as hikui, but also enhance the luster of our koi.
Lourens de Wet

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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Fri May 15, 2009 11:27 am

Hi,

Very interesting.

I personally think it is a genetic transferable disease.

Scientific research has not pinpointed the cause of this disease but research has found cancer type cells contained in samples of Hi-kui, but it is not proven at this time that has anything to do with the disease and speculation continues with cause being listed as bacterial or viral as well as it being a form of cancer, but as said non of this is proven.
Some Japanese breeders believe it to be hereditary and if a breeding pair start producing off spring that display Hi-kui they will no longer breed from that pair, although some people relate liver failure or another problem in the metabolism of Koi.
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PostSubject: Re: Hikui   Fri May 15, 2009 9:44 pm

Nee jong dit lyk vir my Paul byt my so bietjie oor die varsheid van Aqua Master... so sagies sagies... Very Happy jy weet ek het mos hikui gekry en ek gebruik nie Aqua Nutro nie...sorry Mnr Lourens De Wet. Very Happy

Dit moet obviously 'n genetic disease wees want anders sal alle kois van verskillende kleure hikui kon kry of iets soort gelyk as hulle slegte kos eet. Dit is gewoonlike die kois van baie goeie bloedlyne wat dit kry. Ek skat dit is as gevolg van die vervyning van die bloedlyn en miskien "inter breeding"

Hikui kom net voor op die rooi pigment so dit is 'n disease. Dit is oor erflik net soos ons mense ook oor erflike siektes kry soos nier versaking, hard disease, verkalking van are, blindheid.

Daar is mense wat baie goed na hulle visse kyk wat ook hikui kry. Partykeer vergeet ons koi keepers dat kois lewendige organismis is wat ook natuurlike defekte en siektes kry, maak nie saak hoe goed ons na hulle kyk nie.


Last edited by wayneb on Sat May 16, 2009 2:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
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