The Koi Forum

The place where koi hobbyist's and dealers meet
 
HomeHome  PortalPortal  CalendarCalendar  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  MemberlistMemberlist  UsergroupsUsergroups  Log in  
Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
Keywords
pond Light bakki pumps bead virkon waterproofing feeder plants filter shower feeding food filters Potassium skimmer ponds Bakkie anoxic filtration pump chagoi liner salt sand zeolite
Latest topics
» Run in Japan 2016 part 7
Mon Nov 28, 2016 12:06 pm by atb tv

» Run in Japan 2016 part 6
Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:08 am by atb tv

» Run in Japan 2016 part 5
Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:33 am by atb tv

» Run in Japan 2016 part 4
Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:05 am by atb tv

» Pics from Japan report with aquatechnobel
Sun Nov 13, 2016 5:00 pm by atb tv

» Run in japan 2016 part 3
Sat Nov 12, 2016 2:41 pm by atb tv

» Run in japan 2016 part 2
Thu Nov 10, 2016 1:26 pm by atb tv

» Special Japan car
Thu Nov 10, 2016 11:33 am by atb tv

» View of Japan
Thu Nov 10, 2016 11:00 am by atb tv

December 2016
MonTueWedThuFriSatSun
   1234
567891011
12131415161718
19202122232425
262728293031 
CalendarCalendar
Affiliates
free forum


Share | 
 

 Showa Development

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
Chris Neaves



Posts : 465
Reputation : 10
Join date : 2008-04-02

PostSubject: Showa Development   Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:24 pm

Hi,
How do you think this 18 - 20cm Showa will develop?

Regards,
Chris





Back to top Go down
View user profile
Pieter J de Villiers



Posts : 1383
Reputation : 10
Join date : 2007-09-17
Age : 65
Location : Krugersdorp, Gauteng,South Africa

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:28 pm

Hi Chris,

I think it will become a Shiro Utsurimono.
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.ppsecurity.co.za
Cliff



Posts : 876
Reputation : 55
Join date : 2009-07-15
Age : 39
Location : JHB

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:30 pm

Hi Chris,

I reckon it would lose the tancho spot and become a Shiro Utsuri.

Would say it could be a pretty decent SU if that sumi is to come out on it's nose leaving some shiro to break it up in place of where the beni is now. I'd like to think theres too much black in the pectorals and tail.

Otherwise I think it's nice



Back to top Go down
View user profile
Cliff



Posts : 876
Reputation : 55
Join date : 2009-07-15
Age : 39
Location : JHB

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:32 pm

@ Pieter....clicked on submit and told me some other oke was posting Laughing ....seems you just beat me to it Laughing
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Pieter J de Villiers



Posts : 1383
Reputation : 10
Join date : 2007-09-17
Age : 65
Location : Krugersdorp, Gauteng,South Africa

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:43 pm

cheers
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.ppsecurity.co.za
Dave



Posts : 97
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2007-11-04

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Wed Jun 23, 2010 5:50 pm

Yip, I agree it will become a Shiro Utsuri.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Chris Neaves



Posts : 465
Reputation : 10
Join date : 2008-04-02

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 5:57 am

Hi,

Bought at the SAKKS show last year in March: 18 - 20cm in length



Same fish one year later now 42cm


It just shows you how difficult it is to predict the development of a koi.

Regards,
Chris

Back to top Go down
View user profile
Cliff



Posts : 876
Reputation : 55
Join date : 2009-07-15
Age : 39
Location : JHB

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:19 am

I thought that when hi \ beni is gone it's gone.......so would this not be a Beni Matsukawabaki?

I'm amazed to see the hi\beni that resurfaced on this fish.....is this a 1 in a million chance or is this normal???

Back to top Go down
View user profile
Dave



Posts : 97
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2007-11-04

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 10:19 am

eish!!! I guess we were wrong Shocked Surprised
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Pieter J de Villiers



Posts : 1383
Reputation : 10
Join date : 2007-09-17
Age : 65
Location : Krugersdorp, Gauteng,South Africa

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:17 am

Just shows you; never judge a Koi from a photo!

Chris 1 Forum 0 Sad
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.ppsecurity.co.za
Admin
Admin


Posts : 2521
Reputation : 46
Join date : 2007-07-25
Age : 54
Location : Cape Town

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:35 am

Chris, what do you put in that Shogun of yours? Red pigments? affraid

_________________
Paul Viljoen
E Mail: koi@absamail.co.za ; http://www.koionline.co.za

Koi are not my whole life but make my life whole


Last edited by Admin on Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.koionline.co.za
Dave



Posts : 97
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2007-11-04

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 12:38 pm

hahaha, some serious red pigments!!!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
wayneb



Posts : 1745
Reputation : 29
Join date : 2007-12-08
Age : 38
Location : Kraai Fontein, Cape Town Metropol

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 2:13 pm

hmmm... some serious photo shopping going on here. lol

ive never ever seen that before. In 99.999999999999'% of the time the fish would have lost the red mark and changed into a shiro utsuri.

I liked it better when it was small.
Back to top Go down
View user profile Http://www.KoiAdventures.co.za
Admin
Admin


Posts : 2521
Reputation : 46
Join date : 2007-07-25
Age : 54
Location : Cape Town

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 2:31 pm

This is really an unique development.

Herewith a photo of the second(in between) stage that Chris has send me a few days ago which will "confirm" that photoshop was not involved.


_________________
Paul Viljoen
E Mail: koi@absamail.co.za ; http://www.koionline.co.za

Koi are not my whole life but make my life whole


Last edited by Admin on Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.koionline.co.za
Chris Maritz



Posts : 357
Reputation : 8
Join date : 2009-10-06
Location : Port Elizabeth

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 2:45 pm

It seems like pigmentation can be more sensitive on some koi than on others. I had a client that wanted a black koi. I got him 2 black koi's from a friend in East London and brought them down to quarantine for him. 30 min in quarantine (QT tank is white) the one was a greyish/blue ochiba and the other was a ginrin chagoi with a light brown colour to it.

After 3 weeks I moved them from the quarantine tank to another pond with black on the inside and within 20min these fish were pitch black again!!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
vossie



Posts : 677
Reputation : 11
Join date : 2010-05-25
Age : 51
Location : krugersdorp

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 3:37 pm

Daai koi is so gebroei hulle noem dit die nuwe Cameleon-koi hehehe
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.theltbclub.co.za
Jack Bach



Posts : 141
Reputation : 0
Join date : 2009-06-17
Location : Montana, Pretoria

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 4:40 pm

...en Pieter : Chris 1 : Forum 0. Hy kan nie namens ander 'posters' praat nie. Ek glo meeste van ons het geweet dat dit 'n Hi Utsuri sou word Twisted Evil
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Neville



Posts : 1643
Reputation : 1
Join date : 2010-01-17
Age : 69
Location : Krugersdorp

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 4:58 pm


Ja Jack dis hoekom ek nie gepos het. Dit was tog so duidelik soos daglig. lol!
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Neville



Posts : 1643
Reputation : 1
Join date : 2010-01-17
Age : 69
Location : Krugersdorp

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 5:01 pm

I wanted to post and was also going to say I agree it will become an Shiro Utsuri, and that it had too much sumi for my liking. Fortunately never got round to it.

Anyway I think it is a nice Hi Utsuri now.

Or still a showa if it has white left


Last edited by Neville on Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Pieter J de Villiers



Posts : 1383
Reputation : 10
Join date : 2007-09-17
Age : 65
Location : Krugersdorp, Gauteng,South Africa

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Thu Jun 24, 2010 5:52 pm

Hi Jack,

My soul is tired, My body worn, My brain is dead, My heart is torn...

so ...............



Back to top Go down
View user profile http://www.ppsecurity.co.za
Quinton Jones



Posts : 119
Reputation : 3
Join date : 2008-11-13

PostSubject: colour change   Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:02 pm

Chris don't doubt but find this almost impossible to believe. If this is true then it goes against everything I know or have seen about koi. in fact the reverse process it possible - hi utsuri with weak hi losing hi untill you get a bad show or shiro utsuri. wheres the catch?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Chris Neaves



Posts : 465
Reputation : 10
Join date : 2008-04-02

PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Sat Jun 26, 2010 8:04 am

Hi,

In answer to Neville's question - I suggest that this has become a Hi Showa - because of the white still left in places. Without white it would be a Hi Utusri. (Also check on the belly for white).

There are many in the Koi Society and on this forum who are much better at classifying koi than I. But thatís what I would say.

There is no catch. But it does show just how difficult it is to select a young koi for future potential. And it does show that the average koi keeper, like you and I, has a chance of keeping some really good koi.

In this particular case the white on the original baby koi was actually very good - yes, there was too much black, but the good white did not bear and hint of red. If it had turned to a Shiro Utsuri it would probably have been a very good Utsuri because of the original good white. And that threw us all off track. It is an unusual case therefore it is more genetical than anything else. Whatís going to be interesting to see in a few years time if this particular koi does lose its hi and does eventually end up an Shiro Utsuri!

We tend to forget that genetics plays a critical part in each INDIVIDUAL koi. How big it will grow, what the colour will be etc. So while there are very good blood lines and breeders etc - it still comes down to individual genetics.

Keeping that in mind and remember a good koi has a good chance of developing into a better koi. A poor koi will always stay a bad koi.

When I buy babies I grow them for at least three years to give them a chance to develop. But if during that time a Kohaku turns to a Shiro Muji it goes out of the collection. But after three years I then keep one or two, if I am lucky. I keep these and sell the rest off or give them away. In this way I develop my collection and have the pleasure of watching the young ones grow.

Definition of a Shiro:
SHIRO: Although shiro is translated as plain white it must be the ultimate expression of the way a tategoi can develop. "shiro, Shiro, SHIRO - it lost all it's bloody colour".

You want to have some fun with strange definitions of Koi Names?

Regards,
Chris
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Showa Development   Today at 5:12 pm

Back to top Go down
 

Showa Development

View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1

 Similar topics

-
» Growth and development
» bladder development/control?
» Root Crops Not Developing Well
» Fertilizer
» Giant kangaroo rat puts kink in California Valley solar project

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
The Koi Forum :: Koi appreciation :: Photos of the good, bad and ugly koi-